My last one was the Monaco at a 47% discount and the watch was brand new with serial numbers. As with counterfeits, AWA opposes the importation and sale of gray-market … A quick scroll through the site shows a wide variety of watches from nearly every major name in the industry. But the resulting loss of revenue comes at a difficult time, in Asia especially. That’s not the case with Jomashop. If they [watch brands] want to manage the grey market, we are probably the best partner they can work with. Wholesalers like Sam’s Club and BJ’s might carry grey market products. Grey market items are authentic products, made by the original manufacturer but sold outside of the originally intended distribution chain. If it’s peace of mind you’re after, then you’ll have to take or send your watch to a manufacturer-certified service center, or to the manufacturer itself. If the gray market price is around 20-30% off the authorized dealer price, then it becomes a bit iffy. So yes, on the surface, the gray market offers massive discounts over the authorized dealer. So what is the gray market? Your email address will not be published. Plus you end up with a pretty solid collection…. As the name suggests, white market purchases are the purest form of transaction. you're going to have to pay massive amounts to get the manufacturer to do it. The gray market price of the Nikon D810 on eBay – $2,159.95 vs the current price of $2,996.95. How do you see if someone is an accredited seller on Amazon? Aside from microbrands, Jomashop likely carries any brand you can think of, but it depends on their stock at the time. So should you buy a watch from the gray market instead of an authorized dealer? These dealers know which brands are well known and well respected, and will likely gouge you that way, insisting that a watch is worth more because they know you know the name Rolex, and can't check it easily against an external source. We are also pleased to represent Fortis watches from Grenchen, Switzerland. How Should Brands Avoid Selling to the Grey Market? Note that there are legitimate cases where an authorized dealer may give you more than 20% off current list price on a fine watch. Jomashop’s website states that it will service every watch sold on its website for a period of one to five years. If I’m going to spend more than $100 or so on a watch, I like it to mean something or symbolize some stage or accomplishment in my life. Unlike counterfeits, gray-market watches are produced by a brand, but sold outside the brand’s authorized retail network. This is especially true in the luxury timepiece industry, where fakes abound and dishonesty can run rampant. Where Do They Get Their Watches ? The one area where authenticity needs addressing is the boxes and papers. You can get many watches for more than 50% off on the gray market, and in that case, I say, you should always go for the gray market option. Please never use any grey market website to purchase any luxury timepieces. You can ask them about boxes and papers, model numbers, common problems, and any other important questions your research has led you to. They offer men’s and women’s watches, from prices as low as around $50 to north of the $1 million mark. The Authorized dealers on St. Maarten have a 15% year round discount + no tax, which would for many brands and models put them almost at the same price as a gray market dealer. When an experienced collector saves for a Grail piece, they study it. Ended up talking to the dealer again after we received the watch (it didn’t show up looking as pristine as a brand new watch should). Never miss a post, plus grab this free guide (instant download). Since these watches are being sold outside of their original distribution channels, warranties are definitely an issue. Gray market watches are authentic watches from the original manufacturer. Wholesalers like Sam’s Club and BJ’s might carry grey market products. This is how Jomashop can sell new watches at significantly lower prices than a dealer. Absolutely. Many of the better gray market or pre-owned watch retailers offer intelligent, friendly service that most watch … Often when you go to your local jeweler to ask about a limited edition watch, their sales pitch usually involves talking up the model's rarity, while claiming that due to its limited number, the watch holds its value very well. Is Jomashop a legitimate business? This is a risk in its own right. A stark contrast from the white market (in name and legality), the black market includes all illegal sales of any product. Buy from one that's been in business a long time that has a good reputation. Unless you have the cash and are going to an AD, in which case seriously consider giving that money to me. These are not illegal activities. However, you must consider that the brands that have the biggest gray market discount often have very big deals at the authorized dealer too. These aren’t fakes; they’re the real thing, although they are often close-outs or less desirable models. I must presume that a major reason gray market dealers can sell for so cheap is due to their lack of overhead. Home • Blog • Resources • Contact • Advertise, Privacy Policy & Affiliate Disclosure • Terms & Conditions, Copyright © 2020 The Modest Man (Registered Trademark). While the overwhelming majority of Jomashop’s focus is on timepieces (and that’s where we’ll focus this guide), the company carries more than just watches. First, let’s talk about gray market pricing. The cost to repair will have to come out of your pocket. Buying preowned, you have to buy from a reputable seller. Required fields are marked *. No telling how long it has been sitting in a warehouse somewhere. The idea of servicing charges being high is not true as Driver8 said - the whole point of not providing a warranty is to protect the AD who sells the watch to the grey market dealer and prevent Breitling from finding out whether a watch is grey market. That way, the resale doesn’t matter and the watch its self holds much more value than I could ever sell it for! A grey market watch is an original watch produced by the manufacturer. We'd all be better off. Why would some people buy these from gray market dealers? Outside of costco, the only one I've been to was this Longines dealer at an Asian mall that claims he has "extra discounted models, but no warranty" (interestingly enough, that guy was also an authorized Seiko, Longines, and Rado dealer. Like we touched upon earlier, this isn’t a big deal for the lower-end watches, but it can be a considerable issue for luxury timepieces. In this case, that third party is Jomashop. The gray market refers to non-authorized retailers of various watch brands. Duty free at Toronto Pearson (and most airports) is MRSP -5% no tax. Second is price. Likewise, Jomashop is a grey market watch seller, which makes it a totally legitimate business. Some might be located in physical locations, often in the “sketchy malls” of Japan, Hong Kong, or most notably for North American buyers, Costco is also a gray market dealer. Are you in the market for a … A lot of people also seem to believe that watches don’t depreciate as much as their other hobbies, that they can enjoy their watch for a while, and then resell it to the next enthusiast without losing too much to depreciation. Both were authentic and discounted quite a bit from their retail prices. That’s why there is a “gray market” label attached to these products, as you might not know for sure what you are getting. Recommended to you based on your activity and what's popular • Feedback Breitling will of course refuse to service a watch where the serial number has been removed. To surf one of the many unauthorized watch “dealer” sites, better known as the “gray market,” is to find a horological bounty at bargain prices. Also, I love my Planet Ocean and would recommend it to anybody. Hi Adam, may I ask if it came in original box? I think it helps me over the guilt of buying yet another watch, and it gives special meaning to the purchase. And the bill, if you purchased your watch from Jomashop, is likely to come out of your pocket. I’m wanting to buy a Hamilton as a Xmas gift for my husband. Grey market companies do not have access to genuine spare parts. That means the manufacturer is probably going to tell you to take a hike if you take it in for warranty work. Most notably, this includes the Rolex Submariner, which often sells for even more on the gray market than it does at your local authorized retailer. When you get the watch, you can always inspect it for cosmetic defects and obvious issues, and return it if it came defective out of the box. Gray market watches are authentic, new watches sold legally, but not through an authorized dealer. One question though. For anything in that range my highest recommendation would be an accredited seller on amazon. One thing I would add - while I haven’t purchased any really expensive watches on the gray market, I have bought two in the $500 range. The key here is educating yourself on the risks involved and how much they’re worth to you. They’re usually located online, whether it is their on their own website, or on a platform like Amazon, Chrono24, or Ebay. Always purchase your luxury timepiece at that particular AD. So, a used car sale could be a grey market purchase. You're not likely to find big deals on the limited edition or the very small scale production stuff, but usually gray market sellers do sell the classic volume models at a significant discount. You need to understand what Jomashop is, how its business model works, and the difference between white, black and grey market sellers. You should buy a watch from Jomashop. Joma gave us a very hard time with the return but eventually caved. I honestly am not that familiar about brick and mortar gray market shops. Gray market watches are authentic, new watches sold legally, but not through an authorized dealer. In both my experiences though, the pieces I got were perfect and I still wear them all the time. Mike in Houston. They hire whomever will “get it out the door”. We aim to foster an environment where everybody feels safe and welcomed and where people feel encouraged to have healthy productive discussions. Not all Jomashop watches come with them. Very informative post. The reality is that spending your money on a watch from Jomashop is a risk. I find the best deals in Orlando's outlets. With Jaztime.com, for instance, the website offers over 450 reviews, comparisons and ‘how to’ videos on YouTube , as well as a variety of buying guides, blog posts and other online articles. The question of authenticity isn’t the issue but the lack of a manufacturer’s warrant card is. Thank you for putting together such a detailed piece over here. Usually gray market dealers sell watches that authorized dealers cannot sell, those unsold watches get returned to the distributor, who sells them in bulk at vastly reduced prices to the gray market. From a customer service point of view, grey market stores will typically provide much more advice to customers and will also be more honest. Since we already know that the grey market can’t sell fakes and counterfeits, it’s safe to assume that Jomashop’s watches are entirely authentic. Second r/watchexchange as a wonderful community just like this one, but passionate about a different part of fashion (don't let them hear the f-word over there or at r/watches though). You’re buying a watch outside of its intended distribution channel. Maybe the authorized dealer is willing to give you a discount, in which case, it just comes down to whether you’re willing to pay a little bit more for the warranty. Bespoke vs. Made-to-Measure vs. Off the Rack: What’s the Difference? In this case, please, please, please be careful. Gray market dealers often offer prices that authorized dealers cannot beat. Still, as a responsible professional, I decided it was time to see where I could get my D750 serviced, just to make sure everything was working properly. In short, consider anything sold illegally as a black market transaction. 25 Great Watches For Small Wrists (Updated for 2020), The Complete Guide to Business Casual Style for Men [2020], A Beginner’s Guide to Cutting Your Own Hair at Home. Moral of the story... share the grey market price with your authorized dealer and see how close they can get. I believe that the gray market is more in sink with the modern consumer vs the AD bussiness model.Authorized Internet dealers like the innovative Hodinkee online shop is the wave of the future.Authorized pre owned or new sales must be offered on line.Some manufacturers are offering direct sales but their online shops are poorly designed and awkward to navigate and are asking full retail … If brands want to control the grey market, we can help them. For example, if an authorized retailer sells $100,000 worth of watches to the Grey Market, the profit might only be $5,000 to $10,000, but the advertising will give it an additional $5,000-$10,000 profit. Now they realise that we are just the ones that made prices transparent for our users . PS: How do you negotiate for the best deal at your local authorized dealer? We welcome those who want to learn and those who want to contribute. The risk revolves around the watch’s value (with and without the accompanying box and papers) and the chance that something will go wrong with it. This purchase might be a watch, appliances from the local home store, shoes from a high-end dealer or a craft good from a local artisan. And it’s important to note that the risk doesn’t fall on Jomashop—it’s proven itself a reliable and reputable company. As far as warranty concerns go, this is where the grey market falls short. Canon is a pretty forgiving company. It’s important to know if your watch comes with its original box and papers, as display models in dealer cases might not. If you don’t hold onto that, your resale value goes down signficantly. Jomashop purchases the majority of its inventory directly from manufacturer-authorized dealers (or the manufacturer themselves, although this is a taboo practice in the industry). I let my local Omega AD know, but the lowest he would go was about $6k plus sales tax. Is it worth it if it breaks and costs you time and money sending it to the manufacturer, only to have them tell you it needs a new hand-built movement? Anything you’ve purchased 100 percent as it was intended to be sold per a manufacturer/dealer agreement was a white market purchase. How Are Gray Market Watches Heavily Discounted ? As an alternate story showing the other side, I recently purchased an Omega Seamaster Planet Ocean. If you can, find a local independent authorized dealer (brand boutiques and department stores will never negotiate), and bring cash. Chrono24 Review: Is This Watch Market Site Legit? Hi. If you’ve asked the critical questions and weighed the risks against the rewards, and it still seems like the deal for you, then the answer is yes. A Tissot Visodate or Seiko Cocktail Time would be solid first watches, Huh? The dealer was very helpful and wanted us to get the manufacturer’s warranty so they came down on their price to within $500 of Joma and returned the Joma one. If you’ve been saving for hard-earned cash for your Grail piece, you want to know that you’re spending it on a quality watch from a well-respected seller. There are a lot of incredible deals on there and I’ve purchased a number of watches there for great prices that I really like. WatchBuys is the official North American distributor or partner for all brands on our site and is proudly a grey market free zone. The catch is, no matter where the watch gets sold, it’ll add to the advertisement profit. Although we’ve answered the questions around Jomashop’s legitimacy, some watch collectors or consumers are still wary about purchasing a watch from a grey market seller. The warranty covers internal malfunctions while covering almost nothing externally. The idea of buying one online isn't too appealing to me, are there many brick and mortar gray market shops in North America other than Costco? However, even Invicta's official store only sells it for $122.85: https://invictastores.com/invicta-pro-diver-automatic-watch-stainless-steel-case-stainless-steel-band-model-8926ob, Now if you're going onto the gray market, the watch is, $91: https://www.amazon.com/Invicta-8926OB-Stainless-Automatic-Bracelet/dp/B000JQFX1G/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1536700626&sr=8-1&keywords=8926OB. If you’re browsing a grey market site, and the watches are “in stock” or “ships in 2-3 days” (or less) and are offered at 40 percent or more off, these are usually watches dumped by the brand. Does Jomas provide COSC if the watch came with it from the manufacturer? Likewise, you can purchase older stock, like the discontinued Seiko SKX007, knowing you’re getting your hands on one of the last of these timepieces. The gray market does not refer to fake watches, stolen watches, or used watches (well, many gray market sellers also do sell used watches). Usually gray market dealers sell watches that authorized dealers cannot sell, those unsold watches get returned to the distributor, who sells them in bulk at vastly reduced prices to the gray market. There are good grey market dealers and bad. Rolex dealers will never negotiate, but outside of them, I find that most jewelry stores and independent watch shops are willing to negotiate, especially for slow moving models. This is in contrast with the authorized dealers, like the boutiques in your local mall, or the watch counter at your local department store. The apparel and accessory shop consists of the biggest names in fashion like Gucci, Tiffany & Co. and Ray-Ban for as much as 50 percent off the MSRP. Jomashop’s business model is simple: Purchase stock at a low price and resell it for less than a dealer would. Product Reviews Filed Under:Jomashop, watches 7 comments. Consider the 8926OB Pro Diver: https://www.invictawatch.com/watches/detail/8926ob-invicta-pro-diver-men-40mm-stainless-steel-stainless-steel-black-dial-nh35a-automatic, MRSP is $495, which is absurdly overpriced for that thing. Never miss a post, plus grab this free guide (instant download). There is also a relatively unregulated used watch gray market. Or just pick them up on Vacation. It is not quite black market, but it is not a manufacturer-backed retail product either – it is somewhere in between. Unless you’re unusually lucky, any watch purchased from Jomashop isn’t covered under a manufacturer’s warranty. You might save thousands of dollars on a luxury timepiece, but are the risks worth the rewards? 3 of my watches were purchased from 2 grey market dealers. (Counterfeit watches should not be confused with so-called “gray-market” watches. Depending on model, this may be true, but the first thing to remember is this, your watch “starts” depreciating at the gray market price, so for instance, if an Omega Seamaster Professional 300 is worth ~70% as much after 3 years of ownership, you’re looking at around ~70% of ~$2900 (its gray market price), and not ~70% of ~$4000 (its MRSP). When an authorized watch dealer needs to recover some cash, they’ll unload their inventory at near cost to a third party. You can purchase a Patek Philipe, a Rolex or an Audemars Piguet and be totally confident that the manufacturers built these watches to the highest of standards. Ok, so interesting thing about Invicta, is that even they don't think their watches are worth MRSP. What you didn’t cover is differentiating between legitimate grey market goods and counterfeit goods, that would be my concern. After all, Jomashop is just a warehouse with a shipping address. This guide reveals the secrets to help you decide. Customer satisfaction matters so much that they use third-party reviewers to contact their customers and inquire about their satisfaction levels. Jomashop’s business model is entirely legal, and they sell authentic watches. Ever. In the past, some considered Chrono24 to be the root cause of the grey market. Very interesting! Anecdotally, I recently bought an Omega Speedmaster for my wife on Jomashop since it was $1,500 less than the best offer the authorized dealer had (watch msrp was $8k and Joma price was $5,500). Well it comes down to a few factors, the first of which is price. Outside of initial issues that you can catch, usually, when your watch fails in the first year or two of ownership, its either the movement or the gasket. This grey market product movement benefits dealers with cash tied up in out-of-date inventory or those that have lost their authorization. They are not factory seconds or fakes. This begs the question: Should you send a $20,000 Hublot or A. Lange & Sohne to a grey market seller for warranty work? A grey market dealer with a sufficiently wide network can take advantage of this by buying these watches and selling them in another market with a demand for them. Some of the other lens and camera makers … It could simply be that a dealer wants to move to a more expensive product line and needs to liquidate its inventory to bankroll those purchases. However, now that I’m a bit more educated, I would like to go back and not make purchases for premium watches because it knocks the resale value down significantly. Normally Rolex would service any watch even you don't possess the warranty card. Let’s address Jomashop’s reliability on three levels; authenticity, customer satisfaction and warranty. Agreed. A grey market watch dealer is a store (online or brick and mortar) such as Luxury Bazaar that sells luxury watches for significantly less than a brand’s authorized dealer or boutique. Get like a stainless steel watch goes with everything, New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the malefashionadvice community. Because the gray market tradeoff has always been an initial discount for the lack of warranty support. Thanks. The clear difference is they have been passed on to you—the consumer—through an unauthorized reseller. This is when a customer buys a product from the manufacturer or authorized dealer according to the authorization agreement. It most likely won't need one of the 5 year over hauls, but a simple cleaning and water resistance check. This includes the sale of stolen goods, as well as the sale of counterfeit goods or other products that are illegal to own due to copyright laws, local laws or federal regulation. Christopher, I’m the same way. In recent years, brands such as Audemars Piguet have been purchasing used watches, servicing them, and reselling them as certified pre-owned with a manufacturer’s warranty. When buying grey market I would recommend getting it serviced, or at least looked over, by a watchmaker or omega as soon as you get it. Here on r/malefashionadvice, one of the most commonly discussed fashion accessories is the wristwatch. Let’s unpack Jomashop and find out. It’s totally understandable to be concerned about where you’re going to spend hundreds, if not thousands of dollars on a fine timepiece. Jomashop then lists those watches in their store for a significantly lower price than the dealership was trying to sell them for. This is somewhat comparable to the used car market, where leading brands buy, service, and resell their own used cars. For most brands, the average discount ranges somewhere between 30% - 60%. Before we can answer whether or not Jomashop is legit, you need to understand a few things. They’re often educating themselves on every aspect of that watch until the time of purchase. I only buy new watches as reminders of significant moments in my life. Swatch is sensibly cracking down on “gray market” sales of its watches. Battle Scars – Mono Lake, CA (The camera survived!) The key is convenience and service. Grey market profit margins are often less for a third-party seller, but the consumer can save a lot of money on the watch. •Some gray market watches have had the serial number removed from the outside of the case (but not the inside) to prevent the manufacturer from tracing it to the authorized dealer that sold it to the gray market. 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